www.86th.org - Getting started in NFA with a Trust

Getting started in NFA with a Trust

Document Last Updated: 12:00 AM Wed, January 07, 2009

TODO:
- Add FAQ
- Add Sources
- Add URL愀

Table of Contents

Disclaimer
Target Audience
Desired Outcome
Stuff you should know about the NFA already
Trust Example
Trust related FAQ
References
External Links

Disclaimer

I am not a lawyer and this is not legal advice. This is a step by step example of a hypothetical, completely fictional married couple in Ohio who form a Trust and fill out a

Target Audience

The target audience of this write-up is someone who is already familiar with the basic

But, I惴 new to NFA
Why a Trust?
- Eliminates the need for CLEO Sign-off (some states, this doesnt apply)
  Some people simplly cannot get any Title II weapons even though they are legal in their area because they cant find a CLEO willing to sign off on their Form 1愀 and Form 4愀. This may be due to an anti-gun agenda or simply an uninformed CLEO not willing to sign for fear of liability or other legal reprecussions. Also, some people dont like dealing with the hassle of having to go get a "permission slip" every time they want another Title II weapon, or they dont like their CLEO knowing about all of their Title II weapons.
- Eliminates the need for Fingerprinting
  As of January 2008, the BATFE is not requiring fingerprint cards for any paperwork done through a trust. This is subject to change in the future.
- Easier than LLC or Corporation
  It can be expensive to form an LLC or Corporation, and after forming it, there are specific legal obligations such as yearly meetings and/or filing taxes every year. With a Trust, once you form the Trust, there is typically no additional work to register it or file taxes for it.
- Speed
  Theoretically you could form your Trust today and have your Form 1 out in the mail the next day, there is no one to wait on but yourself. Obviously the process should be taken slower than that, but you wont be waiting on anyone.
- Privacy
  Typically, Corporations (and maybe LLC愀) are publicly registered and that information is in the public domain, meeting minutes etc have to be submitted and are available for anyone to see.
- Married Couples
  If you register an Title II weapon to yourself as an individual, only you should have access to it. This means that legally, your spouse should not have access to it which typically means she shouldnt have the combination to the safe its stored in. This also means she cannot go shoot it without you. Forming a Trust with your spouse allows her to have access to it, transport it and shoot it without you!
  TODO: More Reasons
Why Not?
- BATFE愀 positions and requirements are subject to change
  From talking to those who are more experienced in the nuances of the NFA and have been doing it for a long time, they will tell you that the BATFE愀 requirements and position is subject to change. As of now, the BATFE does not require CLEO signoff or fingerprint cards for Form 1愀 and Form 4愀 but nothing is stopping them from changing their position on this. It would be less likely for them to change their position on this for LLC愀 and Corporations because they have been working with these for a very long time and are very familiar with the process.
  TODO: More Reasons

Desired Outcome

The goal of the example is to help show people by example how to go about creating a Trust and complete a

It is assumed that you already know the basic ins and outs of NFA.

Stuff you should know about the NFA already

Basic Terminology
Abbreviations have been purposefully avoided in this write-up but you should know what AOW = Any other Weapon, SBS = Short barrel shotgun, SBR = Short barrel rifle, and you should be familiar with the legal definitions of each. It is assumed that you know CLEO = Chief Law Enforcement Officer and that you know that there are multiple CLEO愀 that can sign off for you. This is very helpful if your sole reason for forming a trust is bypassing CLEO sign off.

Constructive Intent

You should know what this is, and how to avoid it, We all want to stay legal!
All Federal, State and City laws apply
Something to keep in mind is that this guide only complies with federal requirements. Keeping track of state-specific NFA rules would be an entire endeavor unto itself. Rest assured the BATFE is not in the habit of approving any forms that would violate federal or state laws. The very worst that can happen is that your forms will be denied and you will get a refund. Typically the BATFE will contact you and tell you why they cannot approve something and ask you to correct any errors and resubmit the documents.

Regardless, it is always a good idea to be completely familiar with City and State laws / regulations in addition to the Federal ones.

Trust Example

Background Information

This guide will be following a hypothetical person (and his wife) as they form a trust, make a short barreled rifle and buy / transfer a machinegun, all under the trust.

The individuals in this example are

The Husband (guy filling out all the forms), his name is "Husband"

The Wife, her name is "Wife"
They live at 1234 Circle Street CityVille, Ohio 45305
Their County is: Greene

Their Phone Number is: (513) 555-5555

The lower receiver they have that they want to turn into an Short Barreled Rifle is:

Made by: DoubleStar Corp. Winchester, KY
Serial #: 00000001
The length of the barrel they want: 11.5�
The Overall length of such a gun (measured with the stock extended and muzzle device removed [3]): 29.5�

The couple wants all the property to go to their spouse if one of them dies. If they both die they want it all to goto "Final Beneficiary", when this happens, they want "Successor Trustee" to handle the paperwork and have the job of dispersing the property.

With this information, we can begin.
Outlining what is to be created
Since we愉e actually making a trust, there are going to be some resulting documents, and they are as follows.
Making the "Husband & Wife Revocable Living Trust"
- Enter in your first Title II weapon and click Next
- Select 𠐓oth Spouses� and click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Click the Title II weapon and click 幞o Title Document�
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- I Choose 𨯗ll to your spouse�, Click Next
- I Choose 㛝es�, Click Next
- Name an alternate beneficiary and Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- I choose 𨯗ll to your spouse�, Click Next
- I choose 㛝es�, Click Next
- Name an alternate beneficiary and Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Specify if the beneficiary is under 35 and Select Yes/No, I choose No, Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Specify if the beneficiary is under 35 and Select Yes/No, I choose No, Click Next
- Click Next
- Click Next
- Add contact information if appropriate, Click Next
- Click Next
- Click 𡦖review and Print�
- Click 幈K�
- Click Export
- Click Continue
- Save your document
- Click OK
- Click Yes
- Go to the section titled 鏠ertification of Grantors�, this starts the page that you sign / notarize, by default it is often broken up onto two pages as shown below.
- I prefer to modify the document to get this content on the same page as shown below
- Fill out the Date, and Notaries name
- Goto the 𨯗ssignment of Property� page
- Fill out the date that the trust was formed on (printed, signed & notarized) in the first two areas (in red). Since this refers to the date the trust was formed, this date will remain the same for all future 𨯗ssignment of Property�s, Fill in City, State, as well as the date the assignment of property was signed (not necessarily on the same date the trust was formed)
- Print your document out, set it down on your desk
- Go back to Willmaker Plus and select Estate Planning, click 尞iving Trust - Certificate of Trust� and Click 鏠reate Document�
- Select 尞iving Trust - Basic Trust - Wife and Husband�, Enter the Date you signed it and Click Next
- Enter Address and click Next
- Select Yes and Click Next
- Click 𡦖review and Print�
- Click Export
- Click Continue
- Save your file
- Click Yes
- Like above with the Declaration of Trust, the Certification of Trust is likely to have a page break in an important area as shown below
- Format the page so that the page begins with the section 孏his Memorandum of Trust is being signed by all currently acting trustees� and ends with the Notary area as shown below
- This page is filled with the same information as the Declaration of Trust
- Save this document and print it out
- Take the Declaration of Trust and Certification of Trust to a Notary and Sign it in front of them, have them Notarize it in Ink since it will need to be copied
- Sign your Assignment of Property to add your Title II weapon to the trust, this does not need to be notarized.

Making the Short Barrel Rifle

If not already done, add the rifle to the trust with an assignment of property and by adding it to your Schedule A (or B or C), reference it only by Manufacturer and Serial #, NFA status and barrel length is not necessary. Omitting these details can be helpful and negates having to update the trust when the Title I weapon turns into a Title II weapon.

Compile the following documents

Form 1 (two ink-signed originals [4] )

Ensure that the Form 1 is two-sided, they will reject it otherwise [5]

Fill out the form according to this table

Box #	Entry
1	Check 孏ax Paid�
2	Check 鏠orporation or other Business Entity�
3b	Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust 1234 Circle Street CityVille, Ohio 45305
3d	Greene
3e	(513) 555-5555
4a	DoubleStar Corp. Winchester, KY
4b	Short Bbl Rifle
4c	5.56mm
4d	AR-15
4e	11.5�
4f	29.5�
4g	00000001
4h	Husband & Wife Trust CityVille, OH
4i	All legal purposes
7a-e	Check accordingly (better all be No)
9	(Signature of Husband)
10	Husband, Grantor and Trustee
11	1-2-2008 (date signed)

Citizenship Form, Form 5330.20 (two ink-signed originals)
- Ensure that the Form 5330.20 is two-sided
- Fill out the form according to this table
  
  Box # Entry
  
  1 Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust
  
  2 Husband
  
  3 United States of America
- Sign & Date
$200 Cashiers check or Money Order made out to Department of Justice
Copy of Declaration of Trust
Copy of Schedule A,B,C, with the DoubleStar AR15 in the Schedule A
Copy of Assignment of Property, adding the DoubleStar AR15 to the trust
Copy of Certification of Trust

Put these into an envelope and send them to (This address is correct as of time of writing this - January 2008)
Note concerning engraving
Either before or after the Form 1 is approved you will need to engrave the lower receiver with the information in Box 4h. You can abbreviate 𣫮evocable Living Trust� as 孏rust� or 𣫮LT� and you can abbreviate your State accordingly. It is generally accepted to use the initials of the people in the trust as well, many do 鎽. Smith & J. Smith Trust�, I did 鎽S & JS Trust�, some do 鎽ane S. & John S. Trust�, etc. In our example, we are engraving
I choose to get the engraving done before the form is approved because after the form is approved, you cannot leave the receiver at an engraver since it is a Title II weapon.
Send the receiver to Orion Arms or take it to a local engraver, express concerns about not wanting the anodizing to chip due to diamond drag engraving. Work these concerns out with your engraver; some opt for Orion Arms due to the peace of mind they offer as they will not chip the engraving. Ensure that the engraver will engrave to a minimum depth of .003� and that the letters are at a minimum of 1/16� tall and that the engraving is in a location that will be visible once the rifle is assembled. [1]
If you want to know when they received your letter, buy some sort of delivery confirmation or ship with a carrier that offers a tracking number
If you want to know when they cashed your check, call your bank, my bank can / will tell me when a cashier check cashes if I have the check #.
If you absolutely have to know when the form goes pending / approved, call the BATFE, but do not call them until it has been at least 4 if not 5 or more weeks since you sent it in. Tell them that you sent a Form 1 in X weeks ago and that you would like to see if it has gone pending or approved yet. Tell them that you have the serial number handy, they will take it from here.

Note concerning calling the BATFE
This is not a fast process and it is not advisable to constantly pester the BATFE for status updates. If you absolutely have to, do not ask to speak to an examiner, instead allow the person that answers the phones to check the status as they are perfectly capable of doing so and this is less likely to slow down other transfers.
In about 5-7 weeks from the date of sending your forms you will receive one of your Form 1𠏋 in the mail with a tax stamp affixed.
Make 2-sided color copies of this document (with the stamp affixed) and keep them with the weapon at all times. Do not laminate the original; also, scaled down copies can be handy to keep with the weapon itself rather than full size copies.
Store the original in a very safe location.
Finish building your Short barreled rifle and be sure to keep the copies of the Form 1 with the weapon at all times, even when going to the range to shoot it.

Transferring the Machinegun
Buying from a seller in another state will require a transfer from the seller to a class 3 dealer in your state and then a transfer from that dealer to you. This example assumes that you are buying a machinegun from a private seller WITHIN THE SAME STATE. In this example, you are able to transfer directly from person to person.[2] Follow these instructions once you have negotiated to buy a machinegun from a seller.

Compile the following documents

Form 4 (two ink-signed originals [4] )

Ensure that the Form 4 is two-sided, they will reject it otherwise [5]
This will come to you from the person selling the machinegun with most of the information filled out by them. It should have their signature on it as well in box 10, remember you need this form in duplicate!

Fill out the form according to this table

Box #	Entry
1	$200 checked (Might already be checked)
2a	Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust 1234 Circle Street CityVille, Ohio 45305
2b	Greene
13a-e	Check accordingly (better all be No)
2e First Blank	Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust
2e Second Blank	For all lawful purposes

Sign and date in box 2e

Citizenship Form, Form 5330.20 (two ink-signed originals)
- Ensure that the Form 5330.20 is two-sided
- Fill out the form according to this table
  
  Box # Entry
  
  1 Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust
  
  2 Husband
  
  3 United States of America
- Sign & Date
$200 Cashiers check or Money Order made out to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
Copy of Declaration of Trust
Copy of Schedule A,B,C, with the Machinegun in the Schedule A
Copy of Assignment of Property, adding the Machinegun to the trust
Copy of Certification of Trust

Put these into an envelope and send them to (This address is correct as of time of writing this - January 2008)
If you want to know when they received your letter, buy some sort of delivery confirmation or ship with a carrier that offers a tracking number
If you want to know when they cashed your check, call your bank, my bank can / will tell me when a cashier check cashes if I have the check #.
If you absolutely have to know when the form goes pending / approved, call the BATFE, but do not call them until it has been at least 4 if not 5 or more weeks since you sent it in. Tell them that you sent a Form 4 in X weeks ago and that you would like to see if it has gone pending or approved yet. Tell them that you have the serial number handy, they will take it from here.

Note concerning calling the BATFE
This is not a fast process and it is not advisable to constantly pester the BATFE for status updates. If you absolutely have to, do not ask to speak to an examiner, instead allow the person that answers the phones to check the status as they are perfectly capable of doing so and this is less likely to slow down other transfers.
In about 5-7 weeks from the date of sending your forms, the person selling the machinegun will receive one of your Form 4𠏋 in the mail with a tax stamp affixed.
Go pick up the Form 4 and the machinegun from the seller.
Make laminated 2-sided color copies of this document (with the stamp affixed) and keep them with the weapon at all times. Do not laminate the original; also, scaled down copies can be handy to keep with the weapon itself rather than full size copies.
Store the original in a very safe location.
Go shoot your machinegun and be sure to keep the copies of the Form 4 with the machinegun at all times, even when going to the range to shoot it.

Transferring the Silencer TODO: go over this section and validate the info, wording and formatting one more time
Typically you will be buying a Silencer from a Class 3 dealer and he will walk you through the process and tell you exactly what to bring. He will also fill out most of the Form 4, or all of the Form 4 for you. This section is just a summary of the process so you can see what is involved ahead of time.

The following documents are involved

Form 4 (two ink-signed originals)

You get this at the dealer, it will have most to all of the information filled in already by the dealer

Fill out the form according to this table

Box #	Entry
1	$200 checked (Might already be checked)
2a	Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust 1234 Circle Street CityVille, Ohio 45305
2b	Greene
13a-e	Check accordingly (better all be No)
2e First Blank	Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust
2e Second Blank	For all lawful purposes

Sign and date in box 2e

Citizenship Form, Form 5330.20 (two ink-signed originals)
- You will probably get this at the dealer, it wont hurt to bring your own just in case, though.
- Ensure that the Form 5330.20 is two-sided
- Fill out the form according to this table
  
  Box # Entry
  
  1 Husband and Wife Revocable Living Trust
  
  2 Husband
  
  3 United States of America
- Sign & Date
Bring the following with you to the dealer
- $200 Cashiers check or Money Order made out to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
- Copy of Declaration of Trust
- Copy of Schedule A,B,C, with the Machinegun in the Schedule A
- Copy of Assignment of Property, adding the Machinegun to the trust
- Copy of Certification of Trust

The dealer takes care of mailing the documents to the BATFE
If you want to know when they received your letter, ask the dealer to buy some sort of delivery confirmation or ship with a carrier that offers a tracking number
If you want to know when they cashed your check, call your bank, my bank can / will tell me when a cashier check cashes if I have the check #.
If you absolutely have to know when the form goes pending / approved, call the BATFE, but do not call them until it has been at least 4 if not 5 or more weeks since you sent it in. Tell them that you sent a Form 4 in X weeks ago and that you would like to see if it has gone pending or approved yet. Tell them that you have the serial number handy, they will take it from here.

Note concerning calling the BATFE
This is not a fast process and it is not advisable to constantly pester the BATFE for status updates. If you absolutely have to, do not ask to speak to an examiner, instead allow the person that answers the phones to check the status as they are perfectly capable of doing so and this is less likely to slow down other transfers.
In about 5-7 weeks from the date of sending your forms, the dealer will receive one of your Form 4𠏋 in the mail with a tax stamp affixed.
Go pick up the Form 4 and the silencer from the dealer, the dealer will do a form 4473 on the silencer (under your name) first.
Make laminated 2-sided color copies of this document (with the stamp affixed) and keep them with the silencer at all times. Do not laminate the original; also, scaled down copies can be handy to keep with the silencer itself rather than full size copies.
Store the original in a very safe location.
Go put your silencer on a firearm and go shoot it. Be sure to keep the copies of the Form 4 with the silencer at all times, even when going to the range.

Trust related FAQ

This FAQ will deal with

Q.

What do I do with my Trust if I move out of state?

Q.

When the grantors die, how is the property transfered?

Q.

Who in the Trust can possess the items?

Q.

What is the Schedule A, B & C?

Q.

Who are the Grantors and what do they do?

Q.

Who are the Trustees and what do they do?

Q.

Who are the Beneficiaries and what do they do?

Q.

What do I do with my Trust if I move out of state?
A. Generally speaking, when moving to another state with a Revocable Living Trust, you dont have to do anything.

Q.

When the grantors die, how is the property transfered?
A. The property is transfered via a tax-free Form 5 which is filled out somewhat similarly to a

Q.

Who in the Trust can possess the items?
A. ONLY the grantors are the legal owners of the property in the trust and as far as the BATFE is concerned, ONLY the grantors can have access to the property. The restrictions on posession of the

Q.

What is the Schedule A, B & C?
A. Generally your schedule愀 refer to property held in the trust, the schedule A,B & C in this example relate to property collaboratively owned by both spouses (A), property owned by the husband (B) and property owned by the wife (C). It is not entirely clear if Schedules are neccesarry for a valid trust, that sort of question is best left up to a lawyer. For the purposes of this guide, all property is shared and placed into the Schedule A.

Q.

Who are the Grantors and what do they do?
A. In this example the Grantors are the people who form the trust, they own the property in the Schedule A,B & C and they are the individuals that can alter the trust at any time.

Q.

Who are the Trustees and what do they do?
A. TODO: add answer

Q.

Who are the Beneficiaries and what do they do?
A. TODO: add answer

Marking Requirements. http://www.atf.gov/pub/qtrly_bulletins/vol3_qb2001/subpartc.pdf
Transfer from person to person. Section 3.2.6.1 http://www.atf.gov/firearms/nfa/nfa_handbook/0607nfa_handbook-rev.pdf
TODO: add URL for Measuring OAL
TODO: add URL specifying two copies of form 1 and 4
TODO: add URL for Form 1 & 4, two-sided requirements
TODO: add URL for moving a trust state to state
TODO: add URL for the NFA FAQ saying that the BATFE wont approve a form that would be illegal
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀
TODO: add URL愀

External Links

BATFEs list of gun laws by state http://www.atf.gov/firearms/statelaws/26thedition/index.htm
National Rifle Associations list of State Firearms Laws http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/
Wikipedias list of gun laws by state http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_(by_state)

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